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Permlink Replies: 67 - Last Post: Feb 23, 2012 8:43 AM Last Post By: Smiley1965
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 6:43 AM
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Virginia is not for lovers if invasive ultrasound law passes. May be less intrusive then laws passed in other states.
Smiley1965


Posts: 8,219
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 8:09 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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This is such a ridiculous argument. If a woman is willing to submit to a horribly invasive abortion, what's a little old vaginal ultrasound compared to that?
Sean


Posts: 6,516
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 8:18 AM   in response to: Smiley1965 in response to: Smiley1965
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It's medically unnecessary. It's funny that folks want goverrnment out of health care EXCEPT to put in all these crazy hoops for women to jump through to get a legal procedure. Hey, maybe that's the next thing you can require -- make women actually jump through a hoop!
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 2:54 PM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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Do you have any idea how many women actually change their mind after they see their living child on an ultra sound? You would probably be surprised. Why are you pro choice people so afraid of this step that might actually cause a woman to rethink her earlier decision? I thought you were all in favor of fewer abortions. This will produce exactly that result. Do you mean what you say or is that just rhetoric?
Sean


Posts: 6,516
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 3:36 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I don't think that the government should be requiring doctors to do medically unnecessary procedures. Period. Certainly, I would think conservatives would see this a potentially a very bad thing to be doing. I don't know how you can freak out about requiring insurance coverage for contraceptives while endorsing an invasive procedure against a patient's will.

There's a lot of things we could mandate that would reduce the number of abortions. But there's a point under our laws where a woman has the right to make a decision that I might not personally approve of. It would be great if we could legislate away all bad decisions, but that's not the way the world works.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 5:12 PM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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First of all, it doesn't require a doctor to either perform the ultrasound or to read it. It can be done, and usually is, by a technician. As I said, I would think you liberals who say you would like to see fewer abortions would be happy to see a procedure that will produce that result.

As for requiring the church to pay for contraceptives and abortive procedures, that's an entirely different issue and you know it. It's a church and state issue which the liberals like to raise frequently until it works against their purpose.
Sean


Posts: 6,516
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 8:57 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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Shar M wrote:First of all, it doesn't require a doctor to either perform the ultrasound or to read it. It can be done, and usually is, by a technician.

OK, fine, I don't think we should be requiring technicians to do medically unnecessary procedures.

As I said, I would think you liberals who say you would like to see fewer abortions would be happy to see a procedure that will produce that result.

As a society, we can compel behavior in all sorts of ways. We could radically reduce drug possession and distribution if we had the police search everyone's belongings every day. But as a society, we also draw lines and say that people have rights and that we don't allow government to intrude in all decisions made by individuals.

As for requiring the church to pay for contraceptives and abortive procedures, that's an entirely different issue and you know it.

It's not a different issue. It's telling that conservatives are willing to put the "rights" of a non-human entity ahead of the rights of real people. As Jon Stewart pointed out on the Daily Show last night, the governor of Virginia who is going to sign this law was up in arms about pat-downs at the airport and the legislative sponsor of the bill can't stomach HPV vaccine requirements.

Not to mention the fact that this law requires women who are pregnant as the result of rape or incest to go through the ultrasound. Great to victimize them again...
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 9:01 AM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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Sean, from what I have been reading on the internet about abortion procedures, most centers require an ultrasound and/or a vaginal examination prior to an abortion being performed. That only makes sense as it's a medical necessity to determine how far along the pregnancy is and you can't simply take hte patient's word for it. As I have said previously, if these procedures are already being routinely performed, this whole topic is much ado about nothing. Just more empty pro choice rhetoric.
Sean


Posts: 6,516
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 9:23 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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Shar M wrote:That only makes sense as it's a medical necessity to determine how far along the pregnancy is and you can't simply take hte patient's word for it.

So, now you're saying it's a medical necessity and not for the purposes of changing minds? Please try to keep your story straight.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 9:49 AM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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I am saying that the abortion centers are doing it because it is medically necessary. I realize they have a problem with the patient changing their mind. But if it can be done for one purpose, why not the other? You keep crying about it being medically invasive. If that's the case, then it works both ways.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 9:04 AM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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From the Planned Parenthood web site:

+-
What Happens During an In-Clinic Abortion? It¿s common for women to be nervous about having an abortion ¿ or any other medical procedure. But most of us feel better if we know what to expect. Your health care provider will talk with you and answer your questions. But here¿s a general idea of how it works and what to expect.

Before the abortion procedure, you will need to

discuss your options
talk about your medical history
have laboratory tests
have a physical exam ¿ which may include an ultrasound read and sign papers

I have just read the web sites for several abortion centers, including Planned Parenthood. All of them say they use ultrasound. This whole topic is absolutely infuriating.

As I said, much ado about nothing.

Edited by: Shar M on Feb 22, 2012 10:09 AM

Gramps


Posts: 14,434
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 9:11 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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There is a difference between an ultrasound done on top of the abdomen and a vaginal ultrasound, don't you think?
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 9:50 AM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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Or course there is a difference. Neither is a difficult procedure, having had both. Most of those done at the crisis pregnancy centers are abdominal ultrasounds. On occasion, a vaginal ultrasound is necessary. They are both done by a certified sonographer.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 10:59 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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Regardless of who does it. It's the M.D.'s responsibility.
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 2:33 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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I MUST add that ONLY an MD, OD or PA practicing under one of the two can read a sonogram. While the tech may have completed 2 years of training and passed a test to be certified, that individual is still a tech and reading any diagnostic tool is practicing medicine without a license. AND, unless this individual has been given a license (under the state EPA) he/she cannot take any x-rays. So, skip the internals.

As a number of past Surgeons General have noted, if a woman does not have reproductive rights, she has no control her own body.

I have lived quite a few years and I DO NOT need or want your (the general "you", not specifically you Turtletoes) assistance in deciding what is going to be inserted into an orifice...even if you are a female Lutheran. Show me your medical qualifications....hum..............then I might listen. Your interpretations of religion, etc, is your OPINION. It does not need to be mine.

This whole thing stems from President Obama's approval rating improving - with an increase back to baseline - with single females. Now, let's look at that......female alone; no need for a partner (note I did not state married as many stated have not honored same sex unions); independent; can think and act on her own. This is probably the rough spot for many.
I vow to go out and help recruit more single female voters.

I have an earth-shattering suggestion. Since this is Ash Wednesday (has anyone beside me gone yet?) For the next 40 days, how about if each one of us works our way BACK to the cross. I would wager that all the evil foes have been taking up residence of quite some time.

A blessed Lent to all.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:35 PM   in response to: 4Annie in response to: 4Annie
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First time I missed in years.

I was sitting in a garage getting my auto window repaired and new battery to the tune of $550.00 . That's O.K. God gave me the means to have it done and as I was sitting there waiting, I thanked him for that and other Blessings Got home and the electricity was out all over the place. It's back on as FPL kind of puts us ahead when that happens. Hope to make church tonight..

A Blessed Lent to you and everyone here . Hope my kiddies can make it.
Evelyn203


Posts: 125
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 7:20 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I have looked and cannot find an independent report on how many women change their mind after a sonogram. Perhaps someone else can, otherwise that point is questitonable. I did find this, however, from a doctor regarding laws restricting abortions:

"For some doctors, the debate comes down to medical ethics. Legislators without medical backgrounds are forcing their way into the doctor-patient relationships, said Matthew Romberg, a private-practice ob-gyn in Round Rock, Tex., who testified against the bill in front of the Senate committee.

Romberg does not provide what are commonly thought of as "elective" terminations; his patients are women with wanted pregnancies who discover that the fetus has chromosomal abnormalities or physical deformities not compatible with survival. The bill ignores that each situation is unique and prescribes a cookie-cutter script for doctors, Romberg said."

http://www.livescience.com/12886-abortion-sonogram-research.html
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 8:52 AM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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As a volunteer at a crisis pregnancy center, I can tell you that it is quite a few. The next time I go in, I'll be glad to find out the exact figures.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 8:53 AM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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You will likely discount this report since it comes from a conservative web site, but this article states that it is 80%. From my experience that seems likely. This article also says that a pre abortion ultrasound is routinely required at many abortion centers but not shown to the patient. If that is the case, then this is much ado about nothing.

http://www.lifenews.com/2012/01/26/kentucky-panel-passes-pro-life-bills-on-abortion-ultrasound/
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 11:01 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I think she asked for an Independent report.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 1:51 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Do you honestly think a liberal web site is going to post any kind of statistics like that? Or even do any kind of survey? Not!
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 2:12 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Independent would be neither liberal or conservative.
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 1:59 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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Are you saying that women have an ultrasound and are unaware it is being performed...?
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 2:01 PM   in response to: 4Annie in response to: 4Annie
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Where did I say that? You can't have an ultrasound without being aware of it unless you're unconscious. I said that many women are required to have a pre abortion ultrasound; however, they are not shown the results of that ultra sound, a living, heartbeating baby. Abortion centers need to have some means of verifying the pregnancy.
Evelyn203


Posts: 125
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 4:04 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I also rejected all the liberal articles I found. The 80% number, which does not cite a research program either, is only for those who go to crisis pregnancy centers, not all women.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 8:18 AM   in response to: Smiley1965 in response to: Smiley1965
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There is a difference.

One is a choice, the other is forced.

According to the laws of some states, it could be considered rape to use vaginal ultrasound.

It opens a can of worms for doctors as well. They could be charged with perpetrating rape tho. it's the state that demands it.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 8:46 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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I wonder how many jobs they hope to find in Womens vaginas.
Gramps


Posts: 14,434
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 10:13 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Let's see--there are the lab techs who do the exam. The machine makers (probably made in China, though). The makers of vaginal gelly (watch for oil prices to continue to increase). The salesmen of the gelly. The truckers. The people who sterilize equipment. The makers of the sterilization machines. Ya know, there are probably a lot of jobs that will benefit when you think about it.

Don't worry, I believe the law will be challenged right away.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 11:01 AM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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Reminds me. A woman called a huge department store where I once worked saying she wanted to order Vagina Jelly so they gave her the kitchen pantry department.
KayakerGal


Posts: 86
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 7:41 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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I've been dismayed and appalled at many of the cold-hearted, twisted, short-sighted, deliberately inflammatory and insulting things that have been said here, but this comment is a new low.

Saying something like this removes whatever credibility you may have had. It is coarse and in poor taste, and does nothing to further your argument.

This forum has degenerated into a simple waste of time. And it's sad. It could have been an open, honest place for Lutherans from all over to meet each other and talk over the news and world events, to pray for our country together, to support and encourage one another, even if we disagree. (And as Lutheran Christians, we should not be disagreeing on something as basic as a child's right to live!) Instead it's a dark place ruled by a few who make a travesty of the Lutheran Christian identity, who never put the best construct on what another says, or care about another's feelings.

I've seen more kindness and true caring and intelligent conversation from atheists over at the homesteading forums I frequent.

What a shame.
Gramps


Posts: 14,434
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 9:36 PM   in response to: KayakerGal in response to: KayakerGal
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Kayaker

Look to yourself. You have determined that since I am an ELCA member, I am not Lutheran. You have even questioned my Christianity. Don't you think that is deliberately inflammatory? Sometimes I just let your statements stand on their own because it shows just who you are. How can you claim credibility when you yourself make such statements?

You haven't been around all that long. When I was critical of the Bush administration I was called unAmerican, a communist, unpatriotic and more. This has never been a supportive board. It has been marked with strong disagreement and accusations on both sides. (I admit I do it to).
KayakerGal


Posts: 86
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 5:05 PM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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I "haven't been around all that long"? What is that supposed to mean? I'm too young to have an opinion, or you have some sort of idea that I've never been on these forums before?

Whatever.

It's clear you read anything I post carelessly and with bias. I have never questioned your faith. God is the only one that knows if a person has faith or not - not me and not you.

What I have said is that ELCA as a church body is no longer Lutheran, and that some of the congregations are no longer Christian. And I stand by that statement. I also said there is definitely a remnant of faithful Christians still in those ELCA churches. If you can't understand the distinction, oh well.

Feel free to allow my statements to stand on their own. I say what I mean and I have no problem with people using my statements to know who I am. I don't have to claim credibility with you or anyone else.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 9:59 PM   in response to: KayakerGal in response to: KayakerGal
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I agree, Kayaker. We used to have some intense discussions but not the level of vitriol and mean-spiritedness we have these days. And if you don't believe that, check out the topics of the posts and who the majority of the posters are. Harriet and I used to have some pretty intense political discussions but it never rose to the level that we couldn't enjoy one another's company, and we did regularly. I am about to hang up a long careet on LOL. :-( I don't need this anymore. I can find folks more like myselfl to hang out with elsewhere.

Edited by: Shar M on Feb 22, 2012 3:03 PM
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 10:34 PM   in response to: KayakerGal in response to: KayakerGal
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Saying something like this removes whatever credibility you may have had

It's no big loss. Because I'm pro choice, I never had and never would have credibility in this forum. That's the mind set any pro choice people face.

Actually I find it more course and in poor taste when people think it's funny to post a picture of a guy brandishing a rifle.

I have to agree tho. it was smarmy and I had second thoughts before posting it even tho it was a true story.

Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 2:55 PM   in response to: Smiley1965 in response to: Smiley1965
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Yeah, well, on a previous post she told me that a vaginal ultrasound could be dangerous to the fetus. Like abortion isn't. :-(
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 3:49 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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That's just part of it and you know it.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 5:14 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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And what is the other part?
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 6:05 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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It's been on here so often I don't know why you haven't gotten it yet.

Using something like ultra sound requires skill. If the state of Virginia goes ahead and demands women get unnecessary ultra sound , they will need to hire more people and there aren't that many waiting in the wings with that skill. Therefore fetuses can be harmed as well as the woman if it isn't used quickly [about less then a minute} and properly.

Now, as I've said before , I've never had an abortion. I've never had a reason to have one. That does not give me license to mess with other womens minds and bodies who are contemplating ending a pregnancy.
I will continue to pray for them that they make a God pleasing decision and hope the Randall Terrys in this world leave them to make that decision with who ever they trust to help make it. Hopefully a husband and if it doesn't work out that way , a Pastor, or her doctor and if she trusts her Senator {God forbid} then her Senator. Just whoever she trusts with such a heavy decision.

Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 9:52 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Man, you are really stretching to come up with that lame argument. What makes you think there is a shortage of sonographers? And if there were, it's an excellent field for people to go into. You can earn either a two or four year degree. With the job market what it is, this is an excellent opportunity for young people or someone looking to get into a new field to obtain the required training and become very employable. I thought the object of this administration was to create jobs. Stenographer is a job and a good one.

Just as the Americans with Disabilities Act required language interpretation and opened up a whole new field for sign language interpreters, stenographers, etc., I don't see that as anything but a plus anyway you look at it.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 10:14 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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It's not a lame argument. But I'm sure you wouldn't agree after all I said it and I'm pro choice so automatically I'm wrong according to your frame of reference.
. You said yourself it takes two to 4 years. How many are in schools right now studying for that particular type of vaginal ultrasound ? How many more will be needed ? Do you have the figures ? Keep in mind Most hospitals and clinics don't like to hire to do the actual probe and ability to read along with the stamina and strength to move women about, and people skills unless you have a 4 year certificate.

I wouldn't want anyone I loved being subjected to that unless the person doing it had actual experience.

Lame argument indeed. How heartless.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 10:22 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Obviously you have never had an abdominal or vaginal ultrasound. I have had both for ovarian tumors. Believe me, unless the person is extremely ill, it doesn't require any help to get on the table or to move wherever the sonographer asks you to move. This is not a major procedure; I've had plenty of medical tests that were extremely more uncomfortable and required way more skill. You are trying to make this sound like some really difficult procedure and it's not.

I have another question. Isn't any woman who is requesting an abortion required to have a vaginal examination? Why is this any more invasive?
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 10:54 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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You are trying to make this sound like some really difficult procedure and it's not.

I have another question. Isn't any woman who is requesting an abortion required to have a vaginal examination? Why is this any more invasive?

I didn't make the rules. That is what is required for certification.

Some have no problem with vag. exams while others do. Some women have trouble with inserting anything there or even being intimate with a loved one.
Women aren't all built exactly alike.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 8:50 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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That's not an answer to my question. But nice footwork.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 10:19 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I beg your pardon ?


Aside, just got back from garage. Needed new battery and window wouldn't go up or down. About $550.00. As far as window, mech. reconmended making it go up or down at least once a week. The heat makes it stick and go off the track and then it needs a whole cable thing.

Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 11:09 AM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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Are you saying all women are the same . Just like making cookies witha cookie cutter. ?

That isn't true. And can even differ from one exam to the next.

Example:

I went in for a blood sample and one day it took 3 techs. to find the vein and both arms were badly bruised. The next time I went in the tech found it without a problem, no problem.

There is also the matter of threshold of pain. Differs for everyone.

Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 1:48 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Give it up, Turtletoes. The more arguments you come up with, the less likely they are.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 2:28 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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You remind me so much of people I met in front of womens clinics. Blocking the doors and yelling at people trying to get in. They had young men with them with tracks up their arms trying to read the script they were given. Undoubtedly didn't know what it was all about, just doing their community service after being arrested for something else..
Then there were the women who brought their babies and stood with them in the hot sun. Hope they were all right.

I and others had our cars keyed. That was nice too.

And everyone felt justified in their actions just like Randy Terry did for urging the killing of M.D.s
Incredible.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:16 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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That is odd because I have never done that and never would. None of the people I know who are connected with the crisis pregnancy centers picket abortion centers. That isn't what we are about. I'm sorry you don't have a better idea of what crisis pregnancy centers do.

Annie, I apologize for my misspelling. I meant sonographer, as I cited elsewhere in the post.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:20 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I'm glad you didn't.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 10:15 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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It's not a lame argument. But I'm sure you wouldn't agree after all I said it and I'm pro choice so automatically I'm wrong according to your frame of reference.
. You said yourself it takes two to 4 years. How many are in schools right now studying for that particular type of vaginal ultrasound ? How many more will be needed ? Do you have the figures ? Keep in mind Most hospitals and clinics don't like to hire to do the actual probe and ability to read along with the stamina and strength to move women about, and people skills unless you have a 4 year certificate.

I wouldn't want anyone I loved being subjected to that unless the person doing it had actual experience.

Lame argument indeed. How heartless.
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 2:50 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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I'm sorry, I'm not sure where the topic of STENOgrapher fits in with either ultrasound or ADA. Would you be kind enough to explain?
Gramps


Posts: 14,434
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 8:52 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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I propose all men who want a prescription for erectile dysfunction be given a rectal exam first. You never know--you might find a physical reason for being flaccid.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 9:19 AM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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I laughed.
Grumpy


Posts: 1,177
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 4:44 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Lighten up y'all don't even know my Aunt Virginia.

If y'all payed attention at church more often you'd know that sex, consequences and unintended children don't equate to love.
Gramps


Posts: 14,434
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 5:34 PM   in response to: Grumpy in response to: Grumpy
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I thought my postings were pretty light hearted myself.

Like a bumper sticker I saw: If you don't like abortion, don't have one.

Personally, I don't like abortion. So I ain't having one.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 6:36 PM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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What if you miss your period ?
Gramps


Posts: 14,434
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 9:36 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Don't worry. I am beyond that age.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,265
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 21, 2012 9:39 PM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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Then don't worry.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:21 PM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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The amendment makes sense. Apparently the bill did not specify either abdominal or vaginal and the opponents were claiming it would result in an invasive procedure. Passing a want over a woman's belly can hardly be considered invasive.

As for the second article, that's just what they need to pass in Virginia, resulting in more unwanted children. A waste of time and money. But it's not the first time..
wanderer


Posts: 5,069
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:25 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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As for the second article, that's just what they need to pass in Virginia, resulting in more unwanted children. A waste of time and money. But it's not the first time

did you read it? doesn't sound like it.
Shar M


Posts: 15,895
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:32 PM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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I certainly did. There's no ban of female birth control in Virginia or anywhere else that I'm aware of. Women have the right to use birth control the same as men do.
wanderer


Posts: 5,069
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 3:45 PM   in response to: Shar M in response to: Shar M
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not sure where you came up with that one -

but to get back to my other question


http://www.thefrisky.com/2012-02-22/hero-of-the-week-georgia-rep-yasmin-neal-who-wants-to-ban-vasectemies/

last time i knew, G E O R G I A was a different state than V I R G I N I A.

need new glasses?

sometimes it pays to read thoroughly instead of trying to reply pdq.

Smiley1965


Posts: 8,219
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 4:14 PM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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Dang, already breaking my Lenten vow. The first article that was posted about the vasectomies never once mentioned Georgia, so it was logical to assume you were still talking about Virginia. Y'all need to be a little nicer!
wanderer


Posts: 5,069
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 4:45 PM   in response to: Smiley1965 in response to: Smiley1965
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the lady said she read it. so if she did, she would have known one was from virginia and the other from georgia.

makes one wonder what else is quoted without being read completely.

Smiley1965


Posts: 8,219
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 5:03 PM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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Like I said, the post above that had two different links, one about the ultrasound, and the other about the vasectomies, the one about the vasectomies said NOTHING about it being in Georgia. I also read it and didn't see the word Georgia anywhere in the article or on the page. Please point it out to me if I missed it; perhaps I'm getting blind in my old age.
wanderer


Posts: 5,069
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 22, 2012 5:12 PM   in response to: Smiley1965 in response to: Smiley1965
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ajc is the atlanta journal - so it is possible the article could be about georgia - that is where atlanta is -

athens is a town in georgia - that is where the representative is from

http://blogs.ajc.com/political-insider-jim-galloway/2012/02/21/democratic-women-seek-a-state-ban-on-vasectomies-for-men/

In response, House Democrats have scheduled a 3 p.m. Wednesday hearing at the state Capitol, to propose a bill that would ban Georgia males from seeking vasectomies. From the press release:

the video gives the name of the speaker at the very beginning Georgia house of representatives and then under the ladies name it says Georgia House of Representatives.

have a nice day
Smiley1965


Posts: 8,219
Re: Virginia is for lovers ???
Posted: Feb 23, 2012 8:43 AM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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Wow......thank you for so nicely pointing out our ignorance..............

You have a nice day as well....