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Thread: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.


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Permlink Replies: 13 - Last Post: Apr 10, 2012 5:59 AM Last Post By: Turtletoes2
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 12:38 AM
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/vp/46973330#46973330

Fortunately for the G.O.P. this "Immediate effect law" is difficult to follow {at least it is for me} BUT it sure isn't Democratic and will have an effect on the 2012 election.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 7:16 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/04/06/1081137/-Destroying-Democracy-in-Michigan

O.K. This is a little easier to follow.

Destroying Democracy in Mich.
opto86

Posts: 760
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 12:08 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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The last 30+ years mayors spent more than received.

Part of this is due to union contracts that were difficult to live up to.
Also tax revenue changes with 25% population loss last 10 years (now 714,000).
And the Kwame Kilpatrick debacle did not help Detroit's image.

Borrowing more dollars will extend not solve the situation. Hopefully with State involvement a crisis can be avoided.
Sean


Posts: 6,512
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 12:32 PM   in response to: opto86 in response to: opto86
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opto86 wrote:Hopefully with State involvement a crisis can be avoided.

Ah, there's conservatism for you in a nutshell. "Local control" is best, except when we don't like the locals, so we take over. And, the Maddow video is pretty damning. Republican legislators in Michigan are outright breaking the law in deeming these laws passed by a 2/3 majority when they clearly are not.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 12:49 PM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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Republican legislators in Michigan are outright breaking the law in deeming these laws passed by a 2/3 majority when they clearly are not.

The larger problem is it could go through out the U.S.
Sean


Posts: 6,512
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 2:31 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Turtletoes2 wrote:The larger problem is it could go through out the U.S.

I don't think this practice is widepsread at all, actually. It appears to be more of a quirk of Michigan law.

Certainly, the types of laws Republicans are passing in Michigan are being replicated in other states thanks to ALEC.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 6:54 PM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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Sean, I'm trying to understand what you are saying.

On the one hand you say "I don't think this practice is widepsread at all, actually. It appears to be more of a quirk of Michigan law."

Then next sentence, "Certainly, the types of laws Republicans are passing in Michigan are being replicated in other states thanks to ALEC."

Can you enlighten me ?
Sean


Posts: 6,512
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 7, 2012 9:10 AM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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Turtletoes2 wrote:Can you enlighten me ?

What Maddow is blowing the whistle on here is what wandered discusses below -- the fact that laws are supposed to take effect 90 days after the end of the session unless passed by a 2/3 majority. Michigan Republicans haven't had a 2/3 majority but have been deeming their laws passed that way so they can implement them immediately. That's a quirk of Michigan law. And the Republican misbehavior here has resulted in these laws going into effect in some cases a full year earlier than they otherwise would have.

The types of laws that are being passed this way, though, are consistent with the ALEC-written bills seen in many other states.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 7, 2012 10:20 AM   in response to: Sean in response to: Sean
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/vp/46981499#46981499

What has happened since airing show and More on Monday nite according to Maddow.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 1:28 PM   in response to: opto86 in response to: opto86
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Part of this is due to union contracts that were difficult to live up to.
Also tax revenue changes with 25% population loss last 10 years (now 714,000).
And the Kwame Kilpatrick debacle did not help Detroit's image.

How does any of that give the Reps. the right to break the law ?
wanderer


Posts: 5,056
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 7:48 PM   in response to: Turtletoes2 in response to: Turtletoes2
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i have not been paying too much attention to what has been happening in lansing - other than they are passing bills at breakneck spead - since this new governor took office i understand that many many more bills than normal have been made into law.

but what i seem to be finding, is that there is nothing wrong with the laws, just the start date.

No act shall take effect until the expiration of 90 days from the end of the session at which the measure was enacted. The Legislature may give immediate effect to an act by a two-thirds vote of the members elected and serving in each house. (Constitution, Art. IV, Sec. 27.)

which seems to be 25 senators and 73 representatives, based on the number in the legislature of Michigan.

if i understand the emergency financial manager takeover bill passed with 52 yeas, 26 nays and 12 excused - and went into effect immediately. doesn't look like 2/3 majority to me.

i feel we are in for some rough rides for years until people, not companies and corporations, are the controlling force. when companies can give untold amounts of money to the powers that be and pretty much write their own laws, we the people will not have much chance. and it seems that is the way our country is headed. until we all stand up and shout STOP! and enforce it. no one wants to get off their backside and do anything. I kind of like the statement that corporations are not people until texas executes one.

not too long ago on public radio we heard a program about Bell labs and how they started out and how they helped their employees, they wanted the best company, and the best employees and did all they could for that goal. now companies seem to just want the best bottom line - no matter how they get there or who they affect.
wanderer


Posts: 5,056
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 6, 2012 7:53 PM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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and then i wonder how different would the makeup of our legislatures be if districts were chosen block by block - who lives next to whom, instead of helter skelter all over the board to make it a democratic district or a republican district. just a block of voting people who vote they way they want, and use the popular vote to determine the outcome.
Evelyn203


Posts: 125
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 8, 2012 12:23 PM   in response to: opto86 in response to: opto86
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How do you think the Republicans in Michigan plan to fix financial problems? Establishing a dictatorship by an unelected, unvetted, unapproved crony, of course!
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/04/18/968218/-Benton-Harbor-MI-The-Political-Story-of-the-Decade
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: G.O.P. Dictatorship in Mich.
Posted: Apr 10, 2012 5:59 AM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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Maddow heard from an angry G.O.P. {along with others.}

She admits Dems. do quick count as well and she should have explained that BUT according to her there is a difference. The G.O.P. refused to check the count when asked to. The whole thing went before the G.O.P led state appeals court and ---Oh, see the tape, hard to explain..
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/vp/46999907#46999907