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Permlink Replies: 13 - Last Post: Apr 16, 2012 9:33 AM Last Post By: Turtletoes2
Evelyn203


Posts: 125
Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 10, 2012 5:46 PM
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Gramps


Posts: 14,433
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 10, 2012 9:40 PM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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Yes
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 11, 2012 8:22 AM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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Bizzaro !!!!!!!
lonelyfordtruck...

Posts: 228
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 12, 2012 2:34 PM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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Everyday it seems something new happens about the case. Looks to be another one of them nationaly public trial dramas that will be the spotlight over the next several months to a year. Dending how soon they get the case into courtroom.
Evelyn203


Posts: 125
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 12, 2012 9:04 PM   in response to: lonelyfordtruck... in response to: lonelyfordtruck...
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I'm sure everyone has heard that Zimmerman was charged with 2nd degree murder and next hearing is 5/29. No bond requested yet.
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 13, 2012 5:39 PM   in response to: lonelyfordtruck... in response to: lonelyfordtruck...
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The case first needs to pass the Immunity Hearing. Most likely it will not get into the courtroom. See miamitimesonline.com/will-legislature-step-up-to-the-plate-against"stand-your-ground-law"/.
Evelyn203


Posts: 125
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 14, 2012 9:34 AM   in response to: 4Annie in response to: 4Annie
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It may not be as easy to get immunity as you think. Here is the text of the Florida law and issues Zimmerman may have:

"who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony,"

Martin was not engaged in an unlawful activity, he was stalked and accosted by Zimmerman in a place he had a right to be and therefore had the first right to stand his ground. If Zimmerman is going to claim he was acting in his role as Neighborhood Watch captain & had the authority to follow Martin both in the car and on foot, he is way off base. NW regulations do not allow confrontation or the carrying of weapons.
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 14, 2012 10:49 AM   in response to: Evelyn203 in response to: Evelyn203
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Sorry Evelyn, but it is not what I think, it is legal authorities reflecting on the likelihood.
Gramps


Posts: 14,433
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 15, 2012 9:57 AM   in response to: 4Annie in response to: 4Annie
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Even the main legislator who wrote the Stand Your Ground law (yes, it was written in Florida, then copied and distributed by ALEC to other states) said that the law was not intended to shield someone who was clearly stalking an unarmed citizen who was not breaking any law.

If Zimmerman gets immunity it will clearly be an unintended consequence of the law.

It is most unfortunate that it took the death of a young man to get people to start rethinking the issue of how much liberty gun owners should have.
This always happens. The pendulum continues to swing. Used to be people could go in and just buy any gun without a background check, then a (Republican) president and one of his aides were shot. Now we have background checks and Saturday night specials are banned.

http://www.bradycampaign.org/media/press/view/1480/
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 15, 2012 6:27 PM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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Yes, I concur; but, we also don't know what evidence the Prosecutor has, that will be revealed (as reporters tend to do) during the discovery process. And, this will not be the first time an "unintended consequence" has developed.

It is a tragedy...no, a disgrace.. that a national "conversation" on guns has taken this long. Before 9/11 was invited to a conference sponsored by the FBI, State Attorney General, state, county, and local police forces on Hate Crimes. During the presentation, Sarah Brady, with Jim sitting nearby gave a live audio-video segment. Although I have listened to many speech-impaired individuals, I could not understand anything he said. There were few dry eyes in the audience. Just last week I threw out the literature and had to stop reading it as it brought back too many painful memories.

The biggest difficulties - identified during the conference - were the easy availablility of fire arms, trafficing across state lines (usually bought in the south with lax laws), gun shows, unsecured and assembled weapons owned by private citizens for "security reasons", the NRA (Romney has a lifetime membership since 2004), and the illegal possession by gangs.

Back in the early 70s, a neighbor, who is a police officer, came home after his round-the-clock duty and left his service revolver in a locked drawer while he took a shower; his younger brother upset over an incident at school, put it in his mouth and fired. I could recount numerous fatal incidents as well as working with victims who survived. One individual really stands out in my mind, a high school sophomore was on her was home from voice lessons, was shot in her left eye by a "stray bullet"; she is wheelchair bound, spent years in rehab to be able to whisper and when she cried, there were no tears, the outcome from the surgery that saved her life. She had hoped that her messo-soprano voice would be her way out of the inner city.

I pray that the defenders of gun ownership do not have to reevaluate their positions based on personal experience. "What ifs" never end.
Gramps


Posts: 14,433
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 15, 2012 8:51 PM   in response to: 4Annie in response to: 4Annie
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Many states now require locks be put on guns in homes that have young children, but not Washington state. Recently we have had an instance of one kid taking a loaded gun to school and accidentally shooting a classmate as he dropped his school bag on a table. The kids were only 11. Last I knew the classmate is still in the hospital. Another instance of a sheriff's deputy's son accidentally shooting himself because his father left a loaded gun on the night stand.
wanderer


Posts: 5,056
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 15, 2012 9:08 PM   in response to: Gramps in response to: Gramps
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i fear there is something else at play here also - but not real sure what or how to express it.

maybe parental supervision? i don't know.

i grew up with hunting guns and other long guns. they were always in the house. and just two weeks ago when dad was visiting - i learned that there always was a loaded gun in my parents bedroom. we were always told that loaded guns were never allowed in the house, coming in from the porch - everything was unloaded. boy did dad fool us all those years. but they were broke into when i was a baby and a gun was stolen - and dad said ever since there was a loaded gun in his room - us kids never knew - until just recently.

and there never was an gun accident. my father and brother hunted, my son hunts. my sister owned a pawn shop and can break down any gun made. i don't care to be around them.

but never was there an accident.

so what has changed that we have so many accidents now and so many people are killed? i think two were killed down town last night. don't pay too much attention anymore as there are so many murders. i think there were 6 murders the first three weeks of the year.

and another thing - we were at a texas state park in 2007 - getting ready to pull out and cleaning out the trailer tanks. couple next to us were doing the same. we mentioned something about canada and the man, who was from texas, said he would never go to canada. being a bit suprized i asked why - like canada isn't a problem to enter like the dangers in mexico seem to be right now. why, mam, i can't take my guns. if i can't take my guns with me i don't go.

good lord, why did he need guns everywhere he went.

i just cannot understand what the problem is and why we can't fix it.

and then i got a "funny" through facebook today that says you just can't fix stupid - maybe that is the problem. but something needs to be done me thinks.
4Annie

Posts: 882
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 16, 2012 12:29 AM   in response to: wanderer in response to: wanderer
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Sure this will offend some, but, hey...

Why do middle aged men "need" a sports car (I'm of the age when Corvettes, T-Bird convertibles, TR4s, and Porsches were the object of choice) for their virility? I don't see much difference with a gun. To a gang member a gun means prestige and, of course, power by intimidation. Initiation night is well known. And membership is not limited to adolescent boys any more, girls are increasingly killing also. Violence is their role model. Kids don't have the mental capacity to comprehend that life is not like the tv or movie - to them death is not final until it is a family member or friend.

Shortsightedness can be added to stupid.

My dad also had many rifles in the house, some high powered, for deer hunting. Tried venison once,
that was enough...felt as if I was eating Bambi. Although I was taught
how to shoot and, after many trials, remained standing through the
kick-back, I was extremely nervous when I uncovered them during the
estate closing - 30 years ago - and had to remove them. I had no idea
there were so many in the house. A friend in the sheriffs dept.
suggested that I just return them to the state where they were used by
putting them in the car trunk and covering them up. I wonder what would
be said today.

During the riots I worked in a building near the Armory where tanks were housed and heard and felt them roll down the street to "defend" property. Witnessed the second World Trade Center attacks. We can now add to the mix the holy jihad and the next attack.

I also don't understand. One of my patients was leaving church one Sunday morning with her granddaughter and son when he was gunned down on the steps. She would repeatedly ask what kind of people raise kids who have no respect for life. I had no answer. Minutes after the collapse of the Tower I she came to my office hysterical; her niece worked there; as part of triage, we recited the 23rd Psalm and she was able to compose herself, thank God because she couldn't be admitted as all beds were on standby for injuries; I would have had to remain with her under observation. She left to pick up her granddaughter as the school was being evacuated. About 12 hours later she called reporting that she kept reciting the Psalm, alternating with prayer; her niece managed to escape Another patient whose son was car jacked told me "I stay prayed up". I believe that is the answer.
Turtletoes2


Posts: 4,241
Re: Zimmerman
Posted: Apr 16, 2012 9:33 AM   in response to: 4Annie in response to: 4Annie
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I wanted to ask a fellow how it worked so this A.M. I walked into the crowded McDonalds with a gun shaped nozzle in my hand. I held it out and immediately said it was a nozzle for a hose so don't be concerned. {I live in Seminole County near Sanford the town where Zimmerman shot the young man.} Just so aware of how frightening anything resembling a gun can be.

The guy I asked said {tongue in cheek}, "Your trouble is, it isn't attached to a hose." That had the whole place in stitches which relieved the tension.

Well, I'll never do that again.

I have a T-Shirt with the state of Mass. inscribed on the back. A few people asked me why I was wearing a shirt with a gun etched on it.

Seems to me there is a great deal of gun awareness.